ratcreature | so, sometimes I wonder about the audience for this LJ...

I haven't read comics, because I don't know where to start. Your posts are bookmarked, so I can refer to them when I decide to start reading.

Oooh, a newbie in reach of comic fandoms clutches! *makes grabby motions*

I still remember when I started reading superhero comics. It was very confusing (still is actually, I'm still reading with online encyclopedias on hand). Personally I find mini-series, specials and AU versions and such a good way too start, because they don't expect you to know a lot of stuff, but then I love AUs anyway. Do you have any particular heroes you are interested in? Maybe I can help out.

Maybe I can help out.

That's very nice of you. Be prepared for newbie questions, because I have no clue what I'm talking about. And don't feel like you have to answer, just because you offered. I haven't tried to inform myself (because I really have no time at the moment), but when I see the chance to take a shortcut into a new fandom, I take it :-)

You buy comics at comic shops, right?
If I remember correctly, you live in Germany too. Are there any online shops, delievering here? Or is buying comics in an online store a no-no?

Do you have any particular heroes you are interested in?

Sorted by interest (as far as I know now):
Batman, Superman, (Spiderman)

but then I love AUs anyway.

Just to see that I understood this correctly: There are "canon" AUs? They take their own characters and; what? set them in a new universe?

This is very, very confusing.

I'm still reading with online encyclopedias on hand)

Maybe you could point me to them, too?

I'd like to get into reading Batman, do you maybe have any recommendations for that?

Did you draw your icon yourself? It's adorable :-) And I suspect very much true (like with books, dvds, yarn) *sigh*

I buy my comics in my local comic store, but I have bought back issues in online stores as well, and many stores will deliver through an online shop as well, and I never had a problem. I've bought directly from US stores as well for some issues that I couldn't get through German stores, but that is often more expensive because of the shiping and import taxes. If you want to buy online rather than in a local store you should compare which stores offer the best currency conversion rates, and once you decide to want to buy monthly titles usually it gets cheaper the larger your subscription list is. Also, you can buy tradepaperback collections simply at the German amazon.

Also, if at some point you want a large number of back issues and can't find them as collections there is the less legal option to download comic scans. Personally I don't like reading comics on a computer screen much because you can't really look at the whole page comfortably, but it is an option especially for issues hat are older or hard to find or not collected. Also, considering comic prices, you may want to sample artists.

And yeah, there are AU comics. DC calls them "Elseworlds" and Marvel has a "What If...?" line. Marvel's AUs are usually of the branching-off kind, i.e. "What if Aunt May died not Uncle Ben?" and such, and DC has some of that kind (like "what if Kal-El had been found by the Amish?" that's the JLA: The Nail Elseworld or "what if Superman grew up in the Soviet Union?" that's Superman: Red Son) but also completely random ones, like Batman as a pirate or a samurai or a vampire or a werebat or a cowboy... and far weirder stuff, for more examples see my post about Batman Elseworlds here).

I don't read a lot of Superman, but I'd recommend the Superman: Birthright maxi-series for new readers, I think it's collected in a tradepaperback too. The Superman: Secret Identity miniseries was good too. I don't read a lot of mainstream continuity Superman though.

I have a hard time deciding for where it would be best to start with Batman, and I'm still out of the loop with current continuity. Way back I did a post on New Year 2004 looking back at my first months in Batverse comic fandom, A Newbie's Journey into Batverse Comic Fandom, where I talk about getting into comics, but I'm not sure how helpful that would be for you, because I got into it through being into Nightwing/Dick Grayson at first. If you are into interpersonal relationships, the Batman: Gotham Knights series was good for that, if you are into origin stories, I started a geeky series of posts, and have a list of Batman comics dealing with his origins here(which probably have been retconned and/or expanded since then yet again), but I think I need to think about what would be best to get into Batman comics some more.

For Spider-Man, if you can get into classic 1960 comics, I'd recommend the Essential Spider-Man collections from Marvel which collect the early classic Spidey comics in b/w at a very reasonable price, or if you prefer modern ones, get the trades of the current Amazing Spider-Man run starting when JMS takes over the writing.

As for reference sites, for most of the basic stuff, i.e. when you find yourself lost because you have never seen that team name or that superhero before, wikipedia is actually a good start, for Marvel I seldom use more. For DC there's:
The Unofficial Guide to the DC Universe
http://www.dcuguide.com/
and
The Unauthorized Chronology of the DC Universe
http://dcu.smartmemes.com/
and of course wikis just for DC like the DC Database Project:
http://dcdatabase.wikia.com/Main_Page
and many more specific sites for characters.

And yeah, I draw my icons myself.

Thank you so much for this.

What I did: I looked up a local comic store and if I can find the time, I'm going to go there Saturday... And then I'll try to get a compilation of what you recommended re: Batman and what the owner recommends, so I'll hopefully be well prepared (and still confused :-)

If you like stylized art, I'd recommend Tim Sale's Long Halloween. It's a collection of a series standing on its own, and a good, long story:
http://dccomics.com/graphic_novels/?gn=1283
The sequel (Dark Victory) is also good.
http://dccomics.com/graphic_novels/?gn=1241
Though I admit I'm biased as I'm a fan of Tim Sale's art.

Of course Batman Year One is a classic:
http://dccomics.com/graphic_novels/?gn=1287

I don't read comics anymore, but I like your reviews to see where things have wandered in the past, umm, fifteen years.

Wow, that's a long time "dry", I'm sure your finances are healthier than mine thanks to that fortitude. *g*

I'm still in my anti-canon bunker wrt comics, so I tend to skip most reviews, as opposed to the more meta type posts on race, sexuality, and gender as it *relates* to comics.

Yeah, the bunker is understandable. The reason I've been catching up on Marvel first is that I'm actually far more invested in DC and found myself feeling frequently ambushed by merely seeing some spoilers while I didn't feel like reading comics, so I'm actually a bit wary of starting on DC.

mostly i just skim everything to see what you're up to. *g* so no, i don't read the comics stuff too closely, but keep posting it if you're into it!

Yeah, I skim posts about fandoms I'm not interested in too, like the recent flurry of DW posts after the finale on my f-list. It's not so much the basic multi-fandom dilemma of lj f-lists I wonder about, as that with comics, especially Marvel ones I find it hard to guess whether anyone might be interested in talk about them, whereas with tv series like SGA or SPN for example, I see other people and some mutual friends talk about the episodes on my f-list, so through that you already get an idea of the potential audience, you know?

I drift in and out of comics fandom, and right now I'm kind of "out", not for any specific reason except that I've just been more into TV and books than comics lately. Rather than following titles, I tend to follow creators' runs on certain titles -- for example, Giffen-era Justice League, or Maggin's Superman. Right now the Whedon/Cassaday X-Men is the only mainstream comic that is really doing much for me (I'm not that much of a Whedon fangirl in general, but his writing is sharp and Cassaday is an Art God (TM) *g*) but I'm way, way behind on it. Most of what I've been buying lately is indies and manga, and not even very much of that. I write for the comics webzine Sequential Tart (http://www.sequentialtart.com) under my real name; I had a long piece last month on the Mary Jane statuette kerfluffle, although most of what I've been doing for them lately has been the odd little review here and there.

I've been avoiding your posts on the comics I'll probably buy eventually (e.g. X-Men) and skimming the others just to see what Daredevil or whoever is up to these days. Generally my awareness of current events in DC and Marvel can best be described as "clueless". *g*

Do you read indies and OGNs, by the way? I can rec some stuff if you're interested.

OGN? I'm clueless about acronyms. But yeah, I read all kinds of comics. For the longest time I was actually really snobbish about superhero comics, that is my first two decades or so of collecting comics (i.e. before I got dragged into Batverse comics by friends in media fandom in 2003) I read pretty much everything but superhero comics, mostly European comics and some US indie comics. I buy less of either of those currently because silly, angsty guys in tights suck up all my money. But for example I like these: Carl Barks, Alison Bechdel, Enki Bilal, Michel Blanc-Dumot, Alberto Breccia, Charles Burns, Daniel Clowes, Cosey, Derib, Julie Doucet, Debbie Drechsler, Will Eisner, Mary Fleener, André Franquin, Phoebe Gloeckner, Roberta Gregory, Hergé, George Herriman, André Juillard, Isabel Kreitz, Krystine Kryttre, Carol Lay, Jason Lutes, David Mack, Marc-Antoine Mathieu, Lorenzo Mattotti, Dave McKean, Linda Medley, Moebius, Terry Moore, Lillian Mousli, Miguelanxo Prado, Hugo Pratt, Pti'Luc, Don Rosa, François Schuiten, Jeff Smith, Art Spiegelman, Tabary, Bryan Talbot, Jacques Tardi, Adrian Tomine, Bernie Wrightson...

Sorry for my jargon-ism! OGN is Original Graphic Novel (i.e. one that wasn't released as single issues first.)

That's a very impressive list. I really need to get into more European comics; I've only read a few, but the art is just mind-blowingly gorgeous.

Have you read Carla Speed McNeil's "Finder"? It's really fantastic -- I actually quit reading it a little while back (for the time being, at least) because of a personal issue that I had with how she handled one of her characters, but it *is* just a personal issue that probably wouldn't apply to most people, and I'm still recommending it to everyone I know. She does really fantastic world-building and has a nice touch for working real-world issues into her writing in a subtle kind of way.

I have bought a couple of issues of Finder to check it out, but I think they vanished somewhere in one of my "to read" boxes, because I can't recall actually reading any. Is it available in collections too?

Yeah, it's available in collections. I think she has ... 6? maybe 7? graphic novels out. They're on Amazon.com and she's also got a website: lightspeedpress.com. If you do buy one, "Talisman" is the one I recommend starting with; chronologically, it isn't the first, but it's fairly short and self-contained, and very tightly plotted and written. It's a good introduction to her work.

In theory, I'm interested in your reviews, and I've actually dug up some Daredevil recently, but in practice I'm swamped and haven't really had time to read them, beyond going, "Oh, cool, she's reviewing more comics!" *g*

Yeah, it's easy to let comics just pile up, waiting for later. *eyes the large DC mountain waiting for her* Somehow tv is more on a schedule, especially since fandom is more present and "synchronized" with episode squee and such too.

I'm interested in comics, but I don't want to get sucked into any that I'm not currently reading.

Oh, I can understand that. That way lies financial ruin after all. *g* Which series are you reading currently?

"Strangers in Paradise" just ended, and I'm still reading Fables.
I'm also reading Death Note, though sort of doesn't count because it's completed and I've just started it.

I've continued to by SiP and Fables as well, though I haven't caught up with them yet. I'm not familiar with Death Note, but isn't it some anime?

I usually read your posts if it a comic that I'm familiar with. I've been out of comic mode for a while since canon went wacky. I also just haven't had time to catch up on things and still haven't gotten around to finding a nearby comic store since I moved.

Heh, I hear you, I'm still catching up with things from 2005 myself...

I know nothing about comics. No, less than nothing; what I know is a negative amount. But I do watch the journals of a few comics fans. And just in general, I would hope that everyone posts things that interest them, whether it happens to be my particular thing or not.

Hmm, I think I view posting to my LJ as a more audience oriented activity. Don't get me wrong, of course I agree that the basic model is that people post stuff they find interesting to their LJ and then subscribers also into that thing hopefully find it and both sides are happy, and of course with the multi-topic nature of most LJs most readers will skim some percentage of the posts of the LJs they subscribed to. But with most of my fandoms I see other people talking about them too, so you get a feeling that there is an interest in something out there, but I feel comparatively disconnected when it comes to talk about Marvel comics.

Honestly, my internet's been cut off at home, so I haven't been able to comment on anyone lately. >:{ That said, also, I haven't read all the comics you're writing about. I do look forward to catching up with your entries with my 'net access restored (hopefully some time next week.)

That sucks with your internet access.

And I didn't really mean to whine for more attention or anything, I'm of course perfectly alright with people skipping posts or lurking, and I try to tag sensibly so that anyone who just wants to read my SGA related posts or just my fanart (something which after all only appears once every leap year or so thanks to my slothful ways *g*) could just track that tag, and not clutter their f-list with stuff they're not into without missing posts potentially of interest to them, for example. Besides I realize that even if someone is into comics in general, brief comments on some comics they may not even have read aren't a great discussion starter, but when posting on a current tv show episode you see other people and some mutual friends talk about the same eps, so through that you already get an idea of the potential audience, even if nobody replies to your episode-related nattering either, but with comics, especially Marvel ones I feel kind of disconnected, because I don't see many people discussing them in the first place.

For me it's not a lack of interest, just a lack of context. I haven't read the ones you're posting about (and have very limited comic experience in general), so I haven't got anything to contribute.

Also, when I get into a new fandom I get incredibly obsessive, so I haven't really commented on much that isn't Sam/Dean related in the past two months. :)

Hmm, maybe I should post about those Supernatural comics I've read. While I'mnot quite as much into SPN, I can definitely appreciate the obsession. :D

I think what made me post this poll was not so much the lack of comments per se, wrt responses it's not like my posts on tv episodes were hopping with discussion either, after all unlike meta or some controversial character or canon theory, this kind of post just doesn't give that many openings for discussion or urges people to agree or disagree. But with tv fandoms for example I usually see a bunch of other fans (often many other fans) also talking about the same things, so it feels like a shared audience and interest, so you don't worry so much whether anyone else is even into this thing you just posted half a dozen entries on.

I used to read comics as a wee thing, but I've grown out of them. And I've really lost my taste for Marvel, too, and confess to never really being into Spiderman. I prefer DC, but even then, it's so overwhelming. However, this is not to say that if you post about a really interesting DC trade paperback, graphic novel, or something like The Authority, that I won't glee upon your entry. :D But, ultimately, I think you should post what interests you, and don't worry about us.

Actually I'm more into DC as well, far more invested in the characters, making me apprehensive some of tha canon suff I heard about, and also the backlog after pausing to read for a while that much larger and intimidating. I mean, I had one box of Marvel comis accumulated to read over my hiatus (now down mostly to the 1602 and Supreme Power universes) but *five* boxes with various DC titles are still waiting for me.

I find all of your reviews interesting, but must cop to the lamest of excuses wrt not commenting: lack of time. When I'm reading my flist it's mostly skimming, and I just don't have time to get into long conversations. So I apologize if it seems like I'm not interested.

Stuff you've mentioned recently: I really, really liked JMS on ASM (acronyms yike) for a good while, but it's long since lost its appeal. I don't find Joss's Astonishing as, well, *astonishing* as he thinks I should; the space plot bores me and hooking Kitty and Peter up again would have thrilled me when I was 15, but now it's just nostalgia for nostalgia's sake. And you had a lot more patience for Civil War than I did. ;)

No need to apologize for not commenting, it's just that compared to tv show discussion I see very little responses to comics on my f-list (admittedly I don't really follow comic blogs or anything so that's part of it), and it's worse with me being behind, so I have less of an idea of the audience than when I post something about a tv episode when a bunch of other people talk about it at the same time. Hence a poll, which is easy for people just to click.

I think Civil War got bonus points from me because for once it wasn't a crossover event all about mutants and their place in the Marvel universe, or mutants being exterminated, or everybody becoming a mutant... I really wish Marvel would give the mutant thing a rest for a while, but they don't seem inclined to. And okay, there's this Hulk thing right now, but I don't care about the Hulk or whether they shot him into space or whatever that was. The only Hulk comic I read was Hulk: Gray, and that only because I'm a fan of Sale's art.

And yeah the earlier JMS writing for Spider-Man was better, but I'm still entertained. As for Astonishing, I agree that the romance parts where weak, but I don't care about Kitty and Peter one way or another, so I didn't mind. I guess not having a huge background in X-Men comic reading might have helped me there.

so, sometimes I wonder about the audience for this LJ...

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