random curiosity

[ratcreature]

Do book recommendation algorithms ever work for anyone? I mean, I've rated almost all the books I bought on Amazon in an attempt to see if this improves things, yet rarely seem the recs tempting or helpful. For one thing it insists on reccing me the n-th parts of series instead of the first, despite me not having bought the earlier ones. I'm not really interested in reading even the first of the The Wheel of Time series, let alone the 13th part, which Amazon apparently recced me due to having bought The Kingdom of Gods. Similarly I've now entered and rated quite a number of books on Goodreads, yet their recs are not all that helpful either. Admittedly sometimes books crop up that look interesting or some that I've read and liked (and just not entered), so they are not always completely wrong, but I have yet to really feel compelled to read a book from their list next. Well, at least Goodreads thinks I would like to read the first part of The Wheel of Time series (because I added LOTR) not the 13th.

Poll #8357 do book rec alghorithms work for you?

Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 24

View Respondents

Are the automated book rec algorithms on commercial or social book sites helpful for you?

View Answers

Yes, I frequently find new books to read, that I then like, through them.
0 (0.0%)

Yes, I've found good books more than once.
3 (12.5%)

Not really. Sometimes potentially interesting books may crop up, but they get lots in many meh or WTF? suggestions.
12 (50.0%)

Not really. The interesting books that come up are mostly ones I've already read or heard from so there is little added value.
5 (20.8%)

No, the suggestions never really fit.
3 (12.5%)

I don't try to find interesting books this way in the first place.
1 (4.2%)

I don't collaborate in getting data mined like this, and do not feed them my reading choices.
0 (0.0%)

Comments

[owlectomy]

About the most useful thing I get from recommendations engines is that they sometimes remind me of books that I wanted to read, but had fallen off my radar.

[ratcreature]

Yes, that sometimes happens to me too.

I keep thinking that they ought to be better at it somehow, but apparently even entering and rating everything, and giving them favorite genres and such is still not enough data for them to make really useful predictions. There are probably just too many books they have to choose from or something.

[thefourthvine]

I can't answer the poll, because the answer I would need is: No, they never work, except that one. There used to be a recommendations engine called Hypatia at Alexlit.com that worked for me, that gave me excellent suggestions. (Admittedly, it was known as the engine where you rate a whole bunch of books and then it tells you to read Lois McMaster Bujold and The Bridge of Birds, but the fact is that I had never heard of The Bridge of Birds before I hit Hypatia, so that was welcome. And also, even after that, I still got a lot of very good recs. I used this site obsessively for years. I loved it.) But Alexlit went out of business some time ago, as far as I know. And other recs sites simply do not work at all. Amazon's is particularly sucky.

[ratcreature]

I never heard of them. Too bad they didn't sell their algorithm when they went out of business.

[thefourthvine]

I know. It drives me nuts that they didn't sell the algorithm. I mean, the data, sure, don't sell that, but the algorithm was so much better than anything else on the market!

But I also see why it might not have been particularly salable. It considered works, not books - you could get short story or graphic novel recommendations from there, for example. And it considered all works, not ones that were readily available for sale. Most book vendors wouldn't want a recommendations engine that gave you suggestions for a bunch of stuff that was OOP, or that you could only find in anthology that wasn't linked to the work. Also, it went purely on ratings and not on purchasing behavior, and I think commercial sites are mostly interested in finding stuff you're likely to buy, not stuff you're likely to like.

But it's a pity. I miss Hypatia still.

[ratcreature]

This drives me crazy with Goodreads. I mean, since it is not a bookseller it does combine works, but only up to a point. For example I have entered that I own an edition of the complete works of Kafka (naturally in German), in addition to owning two redundant Kafka paperbacks, one collected short stories and Der Prozeß, which naturally enough came about since we had to read some in school, and then it turned out I liked Kafka and got a complete edition later. And yet the moronic engine recommends me Das Schloß (which despite being a fragment is obviously part of my complete Kafka edition since that contains every last scrap of writing as far as I can tell, including diaries and letters and such) and in an English translation no less.

Worse, with another book I entered, Woyzeck by Büchner, it recommends me the very same book, even in an edition by the same publisher, only their annotated version with footnotes. That happens quite a number of books. It's really annoying.

[sholio]

The Amazon one actually works pretty well for me; at least, it exposes me to a number of authors I've never heard of, especially lesser-known or self-published stuff. I'm not sure if I've really bought all that many books via the recommendations, but I enjoy browsing through what it's come up with for me.

[ratcreature]

Yeah, sometimes interesting things crop up. The hit-and-miss ration is pretty bad for me though. Maybe I'm expecting too much, considering just how many books there are, and how small my entered data sample is in comparison.

[sholio]

Looking at the problems that other people are having, it may just be that my reading tastes are really broad -- I will try almost anything, regardless of author or genre, and if I see an author I haven't read before, even if the book that's being recommended doesn't sound like my kind of thing, my usual reaction is "Hmm, what else have they written, and might I like it"? So Amazon's recommendations tend to send me on clicking quests that often bear fruit eventually.

[krait]

I may have had one or two successes? If we're defining successes as "I eventually got a book they recommended", not as "I purchased the item from the site that recommended it", anyway.

Mostly, though, they just keep recommending me things I already own, things have read already and not been impressed with, and things I would not touch with a ten-foot pole (Hello, John Ringo. How lamentable to see you again!

Their algorithms don't seem able to pick up on key elements of my reading preferences -- for example, I like military sci-fi, but mainly only when there's a female protagonist. (And, lately, I've given that up in favour of "only when there's a female author", but that's recent and therefore I wouldn't expect the algorithm to pick it up.) Amazon and Goodreads, unfortunately, keep recommending me horrible things from the Baen Sexist Six* that make me want to throw their recs back with bruising force.

*I say six; there may be more. Bujold once joked that she was Baen's "token liberal", and this seems to be true!

[ratcreature]

Yes, I noticed this lack of nuance as well. For example I like some urban fantasy, but only with certain reservations, that Amazon keeps missing.

[krait]

Hahahaha, yes!

Nuance Number One: NO #^#$*@%*Q(@ VAMPIRES!!

[brownbetty]

Amazon keeps on trying to get me to buy Every Frank Miller Book Evar since I bought Year One.

Thanks a lot, Amazon.

[ratcreature]

Yes, that kind of thing happens to me too. I try to correct it by telling it not to use certain books for recs in the ticky box. It helps a bit.

[krait]

This sounds like my frustration with the constant John Ringo recs it gives me. Why is there not a tickybox for Not Even If You Were Paying Me! ?

[capri]

Don't mind me. I just got here by randomly going through poll ID numbers (http://www.dreamwidth.org/poll/?id=xxxx), because I am a procrastinating uni student. Soon I will stop doing this because I figure it creeps people out when they receive responses from strangers on posts that are... oh crap, this post is a month old. Sorry!

[ratcreature]

I fully support lazy procrastination.

[an-kayoh.livejournal.com]

For one thing it insists on reccing me the n-th parts of series instead of the first, despite me not having bought the earlier ones.

This drives me craaaazy.

[ratcreature]

The only worse thing is how Goodreads for example keeps reccing me English translations of things I've read in German, as well as reccing me separate books when I already told them I own a collected edition containing that very thing already.